Interview With Joel Young – How To Use Non Personal Awareness To Make Positive Change

Posted on October 3rd, 2011 by Colin and is posted in Interviews

                                                                  Interview With Joel Young – How To Use Non Personal Awareness To Make Positive Change                                

My special guest on the “interview with the experts” series is Joel Young -

This interview follows a blog post I wrote called, 7 Of The Best Ways To Clear Limiting Beliefs –Forever.NPA is one of those ways.

Joel Young is the creator & custodian of NPA. NPA stands for Non-Personal Awareness, and the little 6 line spoken-word process gracefully and powerfully melts away the energetic nature of what you are focused on with the realisation that it is not personal.

Joel say’s, “NPA is a very quick and simple process that anyone can use, to easily let go of the yucky stuff and let in the yummy stuff of life”

Some results from NPA include…

  • Joel & many others have lost weight and become much fitter
  • Two year old Jasmine no longer has an ‘incurable’ skin virus
  • Anne watched 18 years of depression leave in two minutes!
  • Damien has given up smoking
  • Laura & many others have let go of exhaustion
  • Paulla has stopped her eye from constantly ‘watering’
  • Harriet & others have noticed the headaches stop
  • Valerie has let go of a lifetime of pain
  • Barry has finally let in love

In this interview Joel shares with you his personal story of how NPA was born and what it is and I get to experience its effectiveness on one of my emotional blocks.

Profound change can be this easy!

Enjoy and remember, if you enjoy it, leave us a comment and give it some Facebook love.

To your happiness and success

Colin (aka The Midlife Maverick) 

(The video take about 30 seconds to download, so be patient. As the interview goes on the video quality improves and you can download the mp3 by clicking on the icon below the video)



Colin:  Welcome to this third interview in the series I’m calling “Meet the Experts”.

 A little while ago I wrote a blog post, which was “Seven of the Best Ways to Eliminate Limiting Beliefs and Emotional Blocks Forever,” and one of those ways was called NPA, Non‑Personal Awareness. I have on this call Joel Young, who is the proprietor and creator of Non‑Personal Awareness, and I asked if Joel could just spend a bit of time with us going into it in a little bit more detail.

I just want to share with you, the listener, that I’m very, very excited about this call. NPA has absolutely exploded around the world, and the buzz that sits around NPA is incredible. I think every now and again you come across something like this, and I feel very excited to be right at the beginning of this journey and this story that is unfolding around NPA.

Joel is a very, very busy man. He’s just moved house, so all that goes around that, and his business is really taking off. I’m so grateful he’s given us a bit of his time to take us through and give us a better understanding of what NPA is.

Welcome, Joel.

Joel Young:  Thanks, Colin. Good to be here. Thanks for having me.

Colin:  Well, it’s fantastic to have you. Why don’t we start with you just sharing a little bit of your history of what you were doing before and what you’re doing now.

Joel:  OK. Well, I’ve been in this field of what you might call human consciousness, personal development, spirituality for a good 16, almost 17 years now. In that time I’ve had the great privilege of working with some amazing people.

It started off with a partner of mine who got sick. We went to the doctor’s, and they had no comprehension of it and pretty much said, “Go away. It’s all in your head,” which prompted us to start looking at alternatives.

But, from that, I happened to encounter someone called Brandon Bays, who wrote a book called “The Journey” and has done several books since. “The Journey,” which is an emotionally focused process, was just beginning back then, and it’s absolutely spread all over the world. I’ve been very privileged to be around that, and I’ve actually taught “The Journey” all over the world.

I’ve also encountered someone called Byron Katie along the way, and I love Byron Katie. She’s famous for the work, “The Work of Byron Katie,” which is very simple, like NPA, and I find her work very inspirational as well.

I’ve done other things as well, but basically it’s been in this field, really. I suppose NPA came along, often say it was born in 2007, January, in a coffee shop in Abingdon in Oxfordshire, England, [laughs] and it was very simple. It came in answer to a prayer, really.

The prayer, or intention if listener prefers that, but really it was a case of, OK, here I am. I’m teaching amazing work, and I’m doing amazing things with people all over the place. And this sort of popped out of me, is there something that wants to come through me specifically? If it is, let me know, and if the answer’s no, that’s fine. Just, I’ve got a sense I want to be clear about that. Within a week, the simple six‑line process that was NPA literally just popped out of me.

I was back in the coffee shop. I was journaling away on my laptop as I do. It popped out of me, and it came with that sort of divine inspiration. And my response, because it is ridiculously simple‑‑we’ll get to it later, but you realize how simple it is‑‑my response was, “You have to be kidding me? This is what you’re telling me is my life’s purpose, what I have to bring to the planet? It’s just too easy.”

But actually [laughs] its simplicity has shown to be its genius, really, because it makes it so applicable, so usable. It’s very ergonomic. I often say it’s like the iPhone for the soul, really. Like an iPhone, you pull it out of your pocket; you do things on it that would have been impossible 10 years ago. Then you put it back in your pocket and take it for granted.

That is like NPA in terms of your spirituality, your personal growth, your sense of well being in the moment, staying present, all these things. You pull NPA out of your pocket. You do the simple process, get on with your life and take it for granted, and that would suit me very well.

Colin:  [laughs] What I love about that story is the wonderful paradox between … You’ve worked with some amazing people. If I was put on a desert island and I could only take three books, then Byron Katie’s book, “Loving What Is,” would be there. The simplicity of four questions and a turn‑around question, and the way that she artfully uses those questions when you hear her working with someone, is absolutely mind blowing.

And so, you’ve been around these amazing people, and all of a sudden what pops out of you is something… Was it six lines?

Joel:  Yeah, six simple lines and statements, if you like…

Colin:  Six statements.

Joel:  …of which, three of those are the same.


Colin:  But on the other side of this paradox is that, if you were not able to fully contemplate the power of them, i.e. the person you’ve become in order to be able to accept the simplicity and move with it, then it still wouldn’t have worked.

So you’ve got that wonderful paradox between something that’s so simple, “What, is that it? Is that all that’s popped out of me? How can I write a book around that and a seminar around that and take that around the world?” Versus, actually, you’ve got to be a certain person in order to be able to get out of the way of yourself.

Joel:  Yeah, and that’s really what it is about. In fact, you’ve hit the nail on the head. Is NPA, or sometimes called a personality bypass, because it bypasses the personality or the mind or the ego, whatever you want to call that, in order to get you where you say you want to go or get out of your own way, [laughs] whichever way you want to look at that, and let this sort of greater intelligence work through you, really, much more cleanly and simply. You have to work for it. [laughs]

Colin:  Yeah. Well, that sounds great. And so, you’re sat there. You’ve got these six sentences, six phrases. OK. What did you do next with it? Did you take it out, or did you keep it to yourself and work with it yourself?

Joel:  Yeah. Actually, I didn’t teach it for about two years. I did just slightly before the end of that two years, I suppose. I very much worked with it in myself. I didn’t really know what I had, to be honest. And one of the things that’s been very interesting about that period of time was NPA, in practicing it with myself and other people, it totally began to undermine many of the things that I’d been taught, and even been teaching, over the previous 16 years. So it was like a re‑education.

One of the things I often to refer to myself, I think, is a 21st century heretic. And because, one of the things that NPA did is turned on its head many of the ideas that I had. For example, the idea that your beliefs create your own reality. I don’t actually believe that anymore, and NPA is what has helped me to see that. There’s a whole other discussion we could have on that. It’s not that they’re not part of the mechanism of creation, but they’re certainly not the source, or the key influence even. So it’s quite fascinating. That’s only come on the back of really experiencing and witnessing things that just totally fly in the face of that.

Colin:  Did you use it yourself? So have you got any personal stories, Joel, of using NPA on anything you’ve worked with?

Joel:  Yeah. I mean, there’s loads of things, and I use it all the time. I’ve used it in a business context on a regular, ongoing basis, because it’s so easy to do. You can be in a meeting, with other people that do NPA, of course, it helps. If something comes up and there’s a friction or a block, you can use NPA. It just somehow smoothes the road and allows the resistances just to pass and the creativity to flow.

But then there’s lots of other very deep, personal things that I’ve worked on, about how I’ve completely changed my relationship to food and exercise with NPA. At the time when it popped out at me, I was about 16 and a half stones. I’ve lost about three and a half stone now. In pounds, it’s about 45 pounds or 50 pounds I’ve lost. But more than that, it’s completely changed my whole attitude and thinking, who I am in relation to all of that, because I was someone who just didn’t ever exercise. As a kid, I was the last picked at school, that kind of thing.

And it was a very interesting thing, because one of the ways that NPA works, it works, really, with awareness. And when you use awareness to make change, I often describe it, it can be a bit sneaky, because you don’t realize things are happening; they just sort of change. My taste buds just started reinterpreting salad and chocolate. So chocolate went from “I want it! It is everything!” to “That’s kind of OK. It’s all right.” And salad went from “I suppose I ought to,” to “Wow! This stuff is amazing!” And that is much more of a sustainable change because it’s come from the inside‑out. And when I say the inside‑out, it’s not even from a mental insight it’s just this physiology is going, “Well, I think it we’ll go differently, actually.” And in math, it’s been a very sustainable change. Now I’m fitter than I’ve ever been in my life and I’m about three and a half stones lighter. [laughs]

Colin:  Lighter. Fantastic. Non‑personal awareness, which I was intrigued when you first told me about it, NPA, non‑personal awareness, because non‑personal, I sort of get that and we use that a lot. “Don’t take it personally.” We sort of understand that. Awareness we understand as well. I say awareness rocks. It’s all about awareness. You can only control that that you’re aware of. That that you’re unaware of tends to control you. I know that NPA takes us way beyond what I’ve just said there. So this non‑personal awareness, can you just explain to us what you mean by that or what is it?

Joel:  Yeah, OK. Great question. I suppose the way I often describe is I often come to quantum physics to give us a good example to understand where I’m coming from with non‑personal. You’re quite right; we generally understand “it’s not personal.” But we tend to take it on a very superficial level whereas, actually, on a quantum level nothing is personal. Nothing is distinctly located in the you that you think you are, which is what we do.

When we personalize, when we say, “That’s me that is,” or, “It’s about me,” or, “It’s because of me.” That is the way that we personalize things. Whereas, in quantum physics it will tell you that everything is energy. I’m sure people who listen to you understand or have heard that. Again, we tend to take that superficially. Let’s really go there. If you really go with everything is energy, just waves of infinite potential. They exist everywhere and that’s one of the key things. Quantum physicists would call that super‑location. Everything exists potentially everywhere. To make it easy for people I talk about radio waves because people can relate to radio waves.

Colin:  Yep.

Joel:  Right now the BBC World Service is broadcasting around the globe. The waves that represent or express BBC World Service are inside your body, inside my body, they’re in the table, they’re in the seam, they’re in the floor. They are literally going through everything. And they’re measurable, we can measure them.

But the same is also true of what you might call depression F.M. Depression F.M. is a universal broadcast of potentiality which is in the ceiling, in the floor, it’s in the table, it’s in your body, it’s in my body. It’s not personal. It’s not personally located.

With Radio Four we take the agreed device, we tune in to the agreed frequency, and that’s the mechanism that humans have technologically designed to translate that potential into an understandable reality. With depression we tend to do this. [laughs] That’s our agreed way of tuning in to it. All of the mental constructs but there’s a way that we can tune in to it. But the reality is it’s everywhere, it’s not personal.

Joel:  In the same way, infinite ecstasy F.M. is also in the floor, in the ceiling, in the table, in our bodies. I often say if we put our minds to it, as humans, to make devices to measure those potential waves we would be able to.

There may come a time very soon, there may even be equipment out there now that can measure those things. We’re getting in to measuring energy around the brain and around the body. But that’s the bottom line, is all these things are everywhere. The way that we get to experience is we really just tune into them. Then we have an apparent reality, which is the expression of those waves but not as personal.

Colin:  Got it. So we could have the “I can’t find the perfect soul mate” radio wave or “I can’t make the income that I want to make” or “I can’t start my own business” or “I can’t get the weight and shape or body or health” radio wave. So it depends on what we’re tuning into, right?

Joel:  That’s right, and again to come back to those beliefs things, beliefs are one of the mechanisms that can be a key point into the mechanism of loosening up our attachment or our stuckness in a particular expression. But it’s not the only way. Again, we can use our physiology. We can use all sorts of different ways of expressing or connecting to or localizing those events.

The beginning of NPA is where we actually identify what is it that is that energetic key‑in that causes you to personalize something in a way that causes you to suffer. Because you know what? It’s not like personalization is intrinsically bad. There’s a tremendous gift in having the shared experience of solidifying with fluid reality for a time.

Colin:  Yes. [laughs] So how does it work, Joel?

Joel:  OK, it’s very simple. It starts with one of two questions, depending on the situation that you’re in because I often say it’s a way to let out the yucky stuff or let in the yummy stuff. Those are the two ways we personalize things. We either take it personal in the way in which we hold something in and say, “That’s me, that is.”

So say my dad says, “Son, you’re an idiot.” I’d be, “Oh, yes. I’m an idiot.” Then I go, “That’s me, that is” and I personalize it. I’ve held it in. Or I’ve held out. He says, “They have the money. We don’t.” Then I exclude myself, and I personalize it to everyone else except me. That’s the reverse way.

When we’re holding it in, we let it go and we just open the doors and it flows out naturally. When we’re holding out, it’s the blocking it. We open the doors and allow ourselves to be included in that vibration or energy.

The main question that tends to get asked first is to let go [laughs] of the yucky stuff, which is what are you experiencing that you would like to allow to pass? In response to that there’s what I call a spew, which is just an opportunity to go, “Yada yada yada yada yada yada yada.” I call it a spew very deliberately because I often say, “How in control of your expression are you when you are spewing?”

And you’re really not. The best way you can serve yourself when you’re spewing with a NPA is just to let it flow and not get into that kind of spiritual personal development analysis, which is just going through a construct because most of the time you’re creating your reality pretty unselfconsciously.

Where the self‑consciousness comes in, it will show up as what I call animation. Something will pop up within that spew, which will be what I call the cookie cutter, the key phrase or the key expression, which could be a belief like, “I can’t do this. I can’t do that”. Or it could be a sound of “hah”, with a physiological component to it.

It could be a symbolic statement, like a “knife in my back” or whatever it is. But when you’re really open to listening to someone just spewing, then something will be in that expression, will just sort of pop out at you, and that’s where you start with your cookie cutter.

And that cookie cutter little phrase or whatever the expression is, it goes into the blanks in these six simple lines. And the six simple lines …

Colin:  Can we do it, Joel? Can we …

Joel:  Yeah.

Colin:  Can you demonstrate it with me?

Joel:  You are right on my vibe, there. I was about to say, well, that’s, why don’t we just do it, because that’s one of the best ways to learn.

Just so you know, the listener can go to my website, which is and download the words of the process and try out for themselves.

Let’s try it. Let’s ask you that question, and so you just, you spew and see where that takes us. Colin, what are you experiencing that you would like to let pass?

Colin:  Well, basically I have four businesses right now, four ways that I earn an income. I earn an income from my consultancy work, which takes me generally away from Spain to other countries, mainly the UK. I have my one to one coaching practice that I can do here from Spain. I have my Done For Me Marketing, which is where I help small businesses with their online presence and page one of Google and I have affiliate marketing, where I earn some income from selling other people’s products.

Now where I make my money is in my consultancy work. That’s where the majority of my money comes in, which takes me away from Spain and where I would like to be earning money is actually selling my own products online, which I’m working on right now. Although you see online many, many people showing that they’re earning millions and trillions from selling products online, there’s a doubt of “Can I really do that?” Is that really possible for me to earn a very good income which allows me to stay here in Spain selling my products online?

Joel:  OK. As often the case with an excellent spiel like that, there may be several that pop out. There are in this case. Again, one of the things that I notice sometimes is you’re asked the question, “What are the experiences that you would like to let pass?” But what you might hear is what really has the animation is what wants to come in as well, and we have an interesting being there what I would call a flip, which is where there are both sides of the equation showing up with animation. It’s worth doing what I call two rounds of NPA to do both sides. Let it out what wants let out and let in what wants to be let in.

Actually, I don’t know if we have time here, but I’d like to do three if we can, very quickly, because they’re all there. And I’m going to start with “my money.” Again, do your personalization. But again, it’s very tempting to go into analysis, why “my money”? All I can say is, when you said it, it popped out. I tend to just do it and see where it takes us. But I think it’s part of [unintelligible 21:36]. Let’s just go for it, so that your listener can have a chance to experience the words or hear the words.

You just need to repeat the words out loud after me and see where it takes us. OK. So repeat after me: This, my money.

Colin:  This, my money.

Joel:  This energy of my money.

Colin:  This energy of my money.

Joel:  This pure energy of my money.

Colin:  This pure energy of my money.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  This pure energy of my money.

Colin:  This pure energy of my money.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  This pure energy of my money.

Colin:  This pure energy of my money.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  And I am willing to experience it.

Colin:  And I am willing to experience it.

Joel:  You need to be still for a moment. Notice and allow whatever is there, it may be something, may be nothing. When you feel it’s at a natural conclusion, let me know.

Colin:  OK.

Joel:  OK. What did you experience there?

Colin:  I don’t know how to put it into words. It’s just a knowing. I don’t know how to say I know other than I know.

Joel:  I think you just did.

Colin:  In terms of physical sensations, there’s a warming up of the chest area, around here.

Joel:  OK.

Colin:  That’s it.

Joel:  Good. Yeah. One of the things that I find very fascinating with NPA is that there are times when literally it will seem like nothing happens whatsoever, but there’s a knowing. It’s a kind of a non‑mental, just somehow there’s a knowing, there’s a little bit of physicalization. It’s great. I call that a subjective win. It means that there’s something that your mind can grab onto and say that the thing has worked.

Sometimes that isn’t the case. And I describe the reason for that is because all the NPA does is open the doors. But how we get to experience any kind of contrast is a result of what I call a divine wind. A divine wind is the animating force that moves the apparent stuff around. And it has its own time agenda.

Sometimes you’ll open the doors and nothing seems to happen, because there’s no wind blowing. And then you go out and move through life, and suddenly, whoosh! [laughs] It’s done, and you think, “When did that leave? I didn’t even notice it.” I have become a lot less attached to any subjective wind these days in myself. Most of the time, mostly people get some kind of subjective experience internally. But people who do NPA a lot will go, “Oh yeah, there wasn’t one.” And they seem to drop the attachment to it because they realize that it works anyway.

Colin:  Yes.

Joel:  That’s one of the things that’s been turned on my head for me.

Colin:  So Joel, you’re saying that this works. So even if someone’s cynical, sceptical, a nonbeliever, if they do the NPA process, they can still get a result.

Joel:  Yeah. Well, we do have lots of examples of people who are, they are completely disbelieving, [laughs] but they come back and say, actually, it did work. On occasion, there are people that don’t notice. One of the things that people often say is, “It didn’t work.” And then, when they talk to me and I compare where they were to where they are, they go, “Oh yeah, all that stuff actually has changed. I just hadn’t noticed.” I’ve seen that with modalities as well as NPA, but we seem to be sort of trained to notice where it’s stuck and not where it gets better.

Colin:  Got it.

Joel:  There was an example, if you’ve got time to give you an example, of a woman who was at the seminar, and at the end of the seminar she had that kind of crossed‑arm, “I didn’t get anything from this” response. So I talked to her. I wasn’t going to leave that alone. She said, “Well, I just didn’t get it all day. Nothing happened, no emotional release. None of that stuff. Nothing happened at all.”

And one of the things that happens if you come to one of our seminars, you become part of the NPA community, and we have regular calls for the community for free. She turns up on one of the calls, and I’m like, “Oh, wow, it’s great to see you here. What’s been going on?” She says, “I’ve been working with this over the last 33 days, trying to sort out my relationship to food, but it still hasn’t worked, Joel.” And I said, “Well, tell me about it. So you’re working on the relationship?” She said, “I’ve still got the cravings. I’ve still got the cravings.” OK. She said, “I don’t necessarily eat the food anymore, but I’ve still got the cravings.”


Joel:  And I said, “So what you’re telling me, is it hasn’t worked because you’re changing your relationship to food, the cravings are still there.” “Yes, they are definitely there.” “But you’re not eating anymore?” And she sort of went, “Oh.” I said, “Maybe you have changed your relationship to food.” She says, “Oh yeah.” And I said, “Why were you originally doing that?” And she says, “Well, I was inspired by your change of body. I wanted that.” I said, “Well, if you’ve got the cravings but you’re not eating, do you think that might have an impact on the size of your body?”


Joel:  That’s not important. But she’d gone into it. It was more like, “Well, I’ve paid my bloody money. I’m going to do it, even though it’s clearly rubbish.

Colin:  Yes.

Joel:  And yet, in spite of the disbelief and the not very positive mental attitude, and not holding the energy of “it’s going to work,” [laughs] it worked anyway.

Colin:  That’s fantastic. So even cynicism is non‑personal. Scepticism is non‑personal. Disbelieving is non‑personal.

Joel:  Well, yeah. Disbelieving and scepticism is in the realm of the personality’s belief in its own power. You see? Whereas what you’re doing is you’re handing that over, and it’s this tiny speck of a mind versus the universe, because [laughs] you’re invoking something that’s much bigger than this little self to be free to operate. It’s fascinating.

Colin:  Very good. Should we carry on?

Joel:  Have we got time to do … Let’s do those two with you. The two sides were leaving Spain and staying in Spain. OK. We’re going to do leaving Spain first, which is the one that you would like to let it pass; you want spend more time in Spain. And we’ll let you bring in. It all relates to the money, source of money, right?

Colin:  Mm‑hm.

Joel:  OK. So just repeat after me. This leaving Spain.

Colin:  This leaving Spain.

Joel:  This energy of leaving Spain.

Colin:  This energy of leaving Spain.

Joel:  This pure energy of leaving Spain.

Colin:  This pure energy of leaving Spain.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  This pure energy of leaving Spain.

Colin:  This pure energy of leaving Spain.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  This pure energy of leaving Spain.

Colin:  This pure energy of leaving Spain.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  And I am willing to experience it.

Colin:  And I am willing to experience it.

Joel:  Again, just being really still, notice and allow what if anything is there, and when you feel a natural completion, let me know.

Colin:  There’s completion.

Joel:  OK. I’ll go straight into the other side. So repeat after me: This staying in Spain.

Colin:  This staying in Spain.

Joel:  This energy of staying in Spain.

Colin:  This energy of staying in Spain.

Joel:  This pure energy of staying in Spain.

Colin:  This pure energy of staying in Spain.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  This pure energy of staying in Spain.

Colin:  This pure energy of staying in Spain.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  This pure energy of staying in Spain.

Colin:  This pure energy of staying in Spain.

Joel:  Is not personal.

Colin:  Is not personal.

Joel:  And I am willing to experience it.

Colin:  And I am willing to experience it.

Joel:  Again, being really still, just noticing and allowing whatever’s here, and when you feel that natural completion, just let me know.

Colin:  Yep.

Joel:  OK. What did you experience there?

Colin:  Same as the first round. Just a knowing, a sort of a breathing out, but a relaxed breathing out.

Joel:  Great. And one of the things that I find with NPA is the fact that that’s one of the biggest, it’s like, “Oh yeah”. It’s kind of a knowing, an “oh”. I often hear that.

Colin:  Yes. Oh. I totally get that. Totally get that. Thank you, Joel, for taking me through that.

Joel:  You’re welcome.

Colin:  I can see the biggest challenge you must face is the simplicity and the ease of this. I could just imagine if someone’s coming to you with years and years of pent up pain due to something, and all of a sudden six sentences in, it’s ‑ “That’s it?”. I mean, the ego, surely, is out of a job if that’s the case. [laughs]

Joel:  [laughs] Well, yeah, that is, I say, the most difficult thing about NPA is letting it be this easy, and that really is the truth of it. I mean, it’s very straightforward. You know, part of what we do in the seminars is it provides an environment for that mind to relax and allow it.

It’s like helping the mind through the detox of coming out of the addiction to difficulty, struggle, the idea that necessary emoting, etc. in order to have profound positive change. It doesn’t have to be that way. And those options are always available in different forms. [laughs]

Colin:  Yeah. That’s fantastic. And why don’t you just quickly share with the listener how this has now moved around the world, because I know it has. I’ve been watching the journey unfold, and the story unfold, and have been very excited about it. So what has happened from the moment that you sort of put the stake in the ground, and said I’m going to start teaching this now, and took it to another level? What’s happened since?

Joel:  Well, as you said, it’s spread enormously. I started teaching it, first of all, in February 2009, and since then, it’s just exploded all around the world. I’ve travelled more than I have in my lifetime in the last year. I’ve gone to Canada, the States, all around Europe, and it mostly started off in the UK.

Also, it’s gone round the world because we were doing online tele‑seminars, and, of course, we get people calling in from Hawaii. People would get up at four in the morning in New Zealand to come to an online, or a tele‑seminar, and then just get on with it. Something in them would recognize it was important enough for them to do that.

It has spread enormously and grown. For me it’s been a case of how can I keep up with this, [laughs] and how can I serve it best, because it clearly wants to run. It really wants to run. And I think the reason it’s been so successful is because it is so simple, so easy, and it works, and that’s a kind of frighteningly successful combination, really. [laughs]

Colin:  Yeah. I mean it’s…

Joel:  And I consider my…

Colin:  Sorry, Joel. If anyone comes onto your website or just puts NPA in, they’re going to see the stories. I mean, hundreds of stories of people that are using NPA in all kinds of ways that are getting profound results, and nothing can spread the way that this has if people didn’t get a result from it. Right? I mean, it’s self evident in that sense. So very powerful.

Joel:  Yeah. People are often very surprised because once they realize it’s so short and so easy they don’t expect much to happen but it does. [laughs]

Colin:  Can you share…

Joel:  Like you say, we have…

Colin:  Go on. Sorry. Go on, Joel. Do carry on.

Joel:  You’re going to ask me to share some of the experiences people have had aren’t you? I can tell. I like to say that there are examples of the amazing miracles and the truth be told those are on many different modalities’ websites, but we have them. There are autistic kids that have found peace for the first time in their lives.

There’s people with 18 years of depression that went in two minutes. There’s a child that had an incurable skin disease that went away in five days. These are incredible things. At the same time there are gazillions of client miracles. A guy called Barry, who finally let love in. A whole lifetime of not letting love in and suddenly he let it in.

It was an epic NPA process. Literally it took almost eight minutes which, by NPA standards, is a long time. He had lots of stuff come through when he did the words but everyone in the room that witnessed that knew that he let in love for the first time. I actually caught up with him, I bumped into him about a year later and I was curious.

He just did it once, that was it, it took the full eight minutes. I said, “Oh, Barry, what’s it like for you now in relation to love?” He said, “Oh yeah, I take it for granted now.” For him it was like, “Yeah, of course I’m loved. No biggie.” That just amazed me. It’s not obviously dramatic but it is. It’s a big deal. He lives in a completely different world now.

He lives in a world where he includes himself in this love thing and that’s a big deal. People are using it, again, like I said, in the office, in their day to day life. They’re walking through the bee stings, the pain just going away. There’s loads, Colin. It’s very exciting and always a constant delight and surprise to me when I hear something new and go, “Wow I never would have thought of that.”

Colin:  Very good. To sort of wrap up this interview, Joel, where can people go? Where’s the best place for them to go? You mentioned your website. Is there anything else? Is there anything in particular when they get to your website that you can direct them to? Information or something for them to watch or listen to.

Joel:  OK. So there’s a whole bunch of resources on the site. Again, I said the URL which is and right now, we’re in September 2011 as we’re recording this, we’re in the process of changing over to a whole new website. Right now you’ll need to enter an email and you can download, you’ll get a meditation and you get the words of the NPA process and those kind of things.

As we step forward you’ll be able to just without doing anything go and find out all sorts of information, look at different audios. There’ll be videos, instruction on how to do NPA.

I also really recommend that people come along to the seminars. Do you need to for NPA? No, you don’t. We’ll give everything away for free. Will you get value from it? Absolutely.

And what do we get at the seminars? We do what I call the core teaching of NPA, how to do it really well, but we also take you to that whole other level that I kind of alluded to earlier, certainly a more heretical level. We really look at the relationship between things, and where NPA really, really kicks off into a whole new dimension.

Also you get to do it with other people. It’s really about coming out of ourselves, and stepping into more of a community togetherness kind of world, and that’s a big part of what the seminars are about.

Colin:  Fantastic. I must say that right now I’m really hot. I feel really, really boiling hot. Is that normal?

Joel:  Yeah, yeah, it’s like most things. When you make a shift, you’re working in a very powerful way with energy is really what you’re doing. You’re using your awareness to have its full power to shift not only your perception but everything in you.

So sometimes phenomena can happen. People can get that kind of heat, the weirdness going on in their bodies. I sometimes describe it for me, it’s a bit like the locked gates. It’s clink, clank, clunk, like that.

I remember one woman who went into a full chiropractic treatment on the chair. She started pulling shapes, and I looked at her across the room and said, “Are you all right?” She said, “I’m not doing this.” [laughs] She was being moved by forces greater than herself, and when I spoke to her, I said, “Well, what were you working on?”

She said, “Oh, I’ve had this stiff neck for ages, and I’ve just had the best chiropractic treatment ever. I feel great, and it just did itself.” So phenomena is OK. I would just say let it be none of your business.

I use an idea of sending the electricians in. You send them into your house, and the lights go on and off and things happen, you understand it. Well, what you’ve done in a way with NPA, you’ve sent the electricians in, and there may be a little bit of system testing going on or whatever. Things are changing. That’s always good.

Colin:  Fantastic. And one last question, Joel. I’m just going to throw this at you, and see where it takes you. Very open question. What’s becoming clearer to you?

Joel:  [laughs] What’s becoming clearer to me? That’s a great question. Oh, I could speak for another half hour on that. I think if I was to give it a one‑line sentence and throw your listener a curve ball, there is no personal will at all involved in the reality of what’s actually happening. [laughs]

Colin:  Oh, I think we’re going to have to do another interview on that. [laughs] Fantastic.

Joel:  That’s it, yeah.

Colin:  Joel, appreciate your time today, and thank you so much for taking the listener into the world of NPA, and giving them a real good idea of what it’s about, and working with me as well. I will blog anything that happens or that I pick up, because, as you say, you never quite know. It’s just now paying attention, right?

Joel:  Yeah, it is.

Colin:  I will do that. I will blog anything. I’ll let you know as well. Thank you very much for your time today, the energy you’ve given to the call today. Really appreciate it.

Joel:  My absolute pleasure. Thanks, Colin.

Colin:  Thank you very much. Bye bye.

Joel:  See you.

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